Thursday, July 27, 2006
"Hasidim can't drive!" - Anti-Semitism, lack of tolerance or fact?
"No, I'm talking about Hasidics. Those people can't drive. How'd they ever give those people a license?"
I told him to send me his forwarding address, because "those people" are staying. If he wants to spend any more summers in Sullivan County, he might want to show a bit more tolerance and a lot less ignorance.
He's not alone. You'd have to be deaf not to hear this talk and dumb not to think it hurts.
In a recent column, Lisa Ramirez urged civility in Wal-Mart. I'd like to take it out on the roads, where we're all trying to first get to the stores. Or anywhere else for that matter.
Civility shouldn't be tied to money, but let's begin with the perception that Hasidic and Orthodox Jews don't contribute to Sullivan's economy.
What, you think they just crowd the roads, the main streets and all the stores and leave empty handed? Locals say shop on Saturday to avoid the crowds. That's cause the rest of the week people are buying.
The sales tax revenue last year in the summer months increased by $3.5 million, to $9.9 million, nearly one-third of the total sales tax revenue for the entire year. That's just one economic indicator. There are property taxes paid as well.
Regardless, all summer there's loathing that borders on anti-Semitism: "Those people can't drive."
"Those people come up from the city, and they think they own the county."
"Those people are so pushy."
Substitute "those people" for blacks. Hispanics. Or just use the word Jews.
Blacks can't drive.
Hispanics think they own the county.
Those Jews are so pushy.
Not in a million years.
Yet, for 10 weeks, folks in Sullivan walk around with a chip on their shoulder the size of skyscraper and a fuse already sizzling because Hasidic or Orthodox Jews have the nerve to drive on our roads, use our passing lanes and take our parking places.
And the hostility comes from Jew and Gentile alike. Year-round Sullivan County Jews tend to separate themselves from "those people."
I've said it myself. That's wrong, and I'm ashamed.
As a Jew who does not wear a yarmulke (a skullcap) all the time, and who doesn't have peyos (side locks), I'm not given the evil eye or the tongue-lashing by folks who show the patience of a 3-year-old.
I may not look like "those people," but I am those people. And so are my Jew and Gentile friends. We're all Sullivan County people. Some just spend more months here than others.
Yes, it is a two-way street. I've had my share of near-misses. I can't tell you the number of people who I've seen behind the wheel of a car who shouldn't be allowed behind a shopping cart. It can be insane.
But it's not an excuse to spew hate.
"We should be able to live shoulder-to-shoulder, without anyone being nasty and saying 'you people' every time we're on the road," explains Rachel Mayer, who comes up every summer from Borough Park in Brooklyn. She and her husband are going to Village Court next month to deal with a road-rage case.
"When I see a Hasidic person driving wrong and being disrespectful, that hurts me more than what other people say. It reflects badly on us. It allows people to generalize. We should all be good neighbors."
That's the kind of talk we should be hearing.
http://www.recordonline.com/archive/2006/07/27/news-barrycol727-07-27.html
"No, I'm talking about Hasidics. Those people can't drive. How'd they ever give those people a license?"
I told him to send me his forwarding address, because "those people" are staying. If he wants to spend any more summers in Sullivan County, he might want to show a bit more tolerance and a lot less ignorance.
He's not alone. You'd have to be deaf not to hear this talk and dumb not to think it hurts.
In a recent column, Lisa Ramirez urged civility in Wal-Mart. I'd like to take it out on the roads, where we're all trying to first get to the stores. Or anywhere else for that matter.
Civility shouldn't be tied to money, but let's begin with the perception that Hasidic and Orthodox Jews don't contribute to Sullivan's economy.
What, you think they just crowd the roads, the main streets and all the stores and leave empty handed? Locals say shop on Saturday to avoid the crowds. That's cause the rest of the week people are buying.
The sales tax revenue last year in the summer months increased by $3.5 million, to $9.9 million, nearly one-third of the total sales tax revenue for the entire year. That's just one economic indicator. There are property taxes paid as well.
Regardless, all summer there's loathing that borders on anti-Semitism: "Those people can't drive."
"Those people come up from the city, and they think they own the county."
"Those people are so pushy."
Substitute "those people" for blacks. Hispanics. Or just use the word Jews.
Blacks can't drive.
Hispanics think they own the county.
Those Jews are so pushy.
Not in a million years.
Yet, for 10 weeks, folks in Sullivan walk around with a chip on their shoulder the size of skyscraper and a fuse already sizzling because Hasidic or Orthodox Jews have the nerve to drive on our roads, use our passing lanes and take our parking places.
And the hostility comes from Jew and Gentile alike. Year-round Sullivan County Jews tend to separate themselves from "those people."
I've said it myself. That's wrong, and I'm ashamed.
As a Jew who does not wear a yarmulke (a skullcap) all the time, and who doesn't have peyos (side locks), I'm not given the evil eye or the tongue-lashing by folks who show the patience of a 3-year-old.
I may not look like "those people," but I am those people. And so are my Jew and Gentile friends. We're all Sullivan County people. Some just spend more months here than others.
Yes, it is a two-way street. I've had my share of near-misses. I can't tell you the number of people who I've seen behind the wheel of a car who shouldn't be allowed behind a shopping cart. It can be insane.
But it's not an excuse to spew hate.
"We should be able to live shoulder-to-shoulder, without anyone being nasty and saying 'you people' every time we're on the road," explains Rachel Mayer, who comes up every summer from Borough Park in Brooklyn. She and her husband are going to Village Court next month to deal with a road-rage case.
"When I see a Hasidic person driving wrong and being disrespectful, that hurts me more than what other people say. It reflects badly on us. It allows people to generalize. We should all be good neighbors."
That's the kind of talk we should be hearing.
http://www.recordonline.com/archive/2006/07/27/news-barrycol727-07-27.html
Comments:
Not every person who feels heimeshe Jews can't drive is an antisemite.
I think people have to realize that if you are wearing anything that determines your Judaism youre on display and must act as perfect as possible.
I think people have to realize that if you are wearing anything that determines your Judaism youre on display and must act as perfect as possible.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by 
: July 27, 2006 4:06 PM
: July 27, 2006 4:06 PM
i think it's actually litvish drivers they are having a problem with. how would they know if a person is chasidic or not. this is rediculous.
anti-semitism is there because it will be there until moshiach comes bimhayru vayyamayni.
until then they won't like how i drive, how i bring up my kids, if they think i smell, what i eat, what i don't eat. if they can't find somthing they will make up somthing to fill in the blanks.
tefillah, tsivuh, tsedukuh; are the only way to make this better.
anti-semitism is there because it will be there until moshiach comes bimhayru vayyamayni.
until then they won't like how i drive, how i bring up my kids, if they think i smell, what i eat, what i don't eat. if they can't find somthing they will make up somthing to fill in the blanks.
tefillah, tsivuh, tsedukuh; are the only way to make this better.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 28, 2006 12:02 AM
: July 28, 2006 12:02 AM
I don't think he meant hasidic as much as he meant Orthodox. It is a common mistake.
While antisemitism will always be around we all still have to serve as a light among the nations. There is some truth to the article. Not all frum people act perfectly all the time. You can't just discount what everything everyone has to say as antisemitism.
While antisemitism will always be around we all still have to serve as a light among the nations. There is some truth to the article. Not all frum people act perfectly all the time. You can't just discount what everything everyone has to say as antisemitism.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 28, 2006 9:47 AM
: July 28, 2006 9:47 AM
Hassid Hate - Hassid Hate
---------------------------
No matter what the Hassid will do he will be criticized.
Drive like a mentch and they'll start complaining what type of car you drive. (The Hassid's with the Escalades think they own the world or The Hassid with the Station Wagon....)
You'll never make them happy (unless you disappear).
I was in New Hampshire for two weeks this summer, the local yokels were complaining about the Hassidim too. (No, not about their driving, just that they "takeover" the area when they come).
Why is it that when some little accident happens and the locals take care of it, the Herald will mention every agency involved, but when Hatzolah does a great job, like they did on Glen Wild road, no mention of Hatzolah, just "rescuers". Generic people, “rescuers”. (And Of course no mention of the Hatzolah Medic who was stopped -maybe for a valid reason) but NOT LET GO!!!!! WHY?????
They HATE Hatzolah.
They HATE the Hassidic Jews at Wal-Mart (they do like their money though)
They HATE the heimishe Bungalow colonies.
They HATE Viznitz for trying to erect a village under their noses.
They DESPISE AND HATE Kirys Joel and all it's "Hassidim" - Read the Herald and you'll see that KJ gets more coverage than the war in Iraq.
They HATE the little "enclave" (as they call it) called New Square.
No matter what we do we are HATED will be hated and despised just because we are different. PERIOD.
Acting nicer will make a kiddush Hashem but you will still be hated.
Now, all you self-hating Chassidishe bloggers who love to scorn your fellow brothers for whatever it is they do. Don't think for one second that "they" like you moreThey want to get rid of you just like they want to get rid of the rest of us.
Sullivan county jail is full of LOCAL thieves swindlers and rapists, that's not a problem, the local violence (drugs, stabbings and the like) is not the problem, the REAL problem is the few HassidIm who come here in the summer who clog up Wal-mart and drive like maniacs.
---------------------------
No matter what the Hassid will do he will be criticized.
Drive like a mentch and they'll start complaining what type of car you drive. (The Hassid's with the Escalades think they own the world or The Hassid with the Station Wagon....)
You'll never make them happy (unless you disappear).
I was in New Hampshire for two weeks this summer, the local yokels were complaining about the Hassidim too. (No, not about their driving, just that they "takeover" the area when they come).
Why is it that when some little accident happens and the locals take care of it, the Herald will mention every agency involved, but when Hatzolah does a great job, like they did on Glen Wild road, no mention of Hatzolah, just "rescuers". Generic people, “rescuers”. (And Of course no mention of the Hatzolah Medic who was stopped -maybe for a valid reason) but NOT LET GO!!!!! WHY?????
They HATE Hatzolah.
They HATE the Hassidic Jews at Wal-Mart (they do like their money though)
They HATE the heimishe Bungalow colonies.
They HATE Viznitz for trying to erect a village under their noses.
They DESPISE AND HATE Kirys Joel and all it's "Hassidim" - Read the Herald and you'll see that KJ gets more coverage than the war in Iraq.
They HATE the little "enclave" (as they call it) called New Square.
No matter what we do we are HATED will be hated and despised just because we are different. PERIOD.
Acting nicer will make a kiddush Hashem but you will still be hated.
Now, all you self-hating Chassidishe bloggers who love to scorn your fellow brothers for whatever it is they do. Don't think for one second that "they" like you moreThey want to get rid of you just like they want to get rid of the rest of us.
Sullivan county jail is full of LOCAL thieves swindlers and rapists, that's not a problem, the local violence (drugs, stabbings and the like) is not the problem, the REAL problem is the few HassidIm who come here in the summer who clog up Wal-mart and drive like maniacs.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 30, 2006 12:43 AM
: July 30, 2006 12:43 AM
All I can say is the learned poster above me demonstrates perfectly the cynical, ego-centric attitude that unfortunately pervades orthodox jewry today.
For shame!
It is far easier to stick our fingers in our ears and hurl accusations of anti-semitism/ignorance/xenophobia/whatever, than to actually sit down and analyze our behavior, and begin to take responsibility for our actions.
Kudos Chaptzem for a fantastic, and unfortunately all too relevant post.
For shame!
It is far easier to stick our fingers in our ears and hurl accusations of anti-semitism/ignorance/xenophobia/whatever, than to actually sit down and analyze our behavior, and begin to take responsibility for our actions.
Kudos Chaptzem for a fantastic, and unfortunately all too relevant post.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 31, 2006 1:09 AM
: July 31, 2006 1:09 AM
"It is far easier to stick our fingers in our ears and hurl accusations of anti-Semitism/ignorance/xenophobia/whatever, than to actually sit down and analyze our behavior, and begin to take responsibility for our actions."
EXCUSE ME??
Anti-Semitism? Who ever mentioned that??
Hate is what I said NOT anti-Semitism.
Never did I say that we are all Tzaddikim.
However, don't get fooled by the so-called excuses they find to bash us with.
The Lines at Wal-Mart and the reckless driving are a LOUSY excuse at best.
In the winter months there are NO lines at Wal-Mart and there are no "Hassidic" reckless drivers, yet the hatred that spills out of that rag sheet AKA The Times Herald is SCARY. (aka the winter residents of South Fallsburg and Kiameshe - never mind KJ...)
THe Wal-Mart lines and crazy driving is just a smokescreen.
They HATE us PERIOD.
They hate your "black hats"
They hate your "fuzzy peyos"
They hate your "million little kids"
EXCUSE ME??
Anti-Semitism? Who ever mentioned that??
Hate is what I said NOT anti-Semitism.
Never did I say that we are all Tzaddikim.
However, don't get fooled by the so-called excuses they find to bash us with.
The Lines at Wal-Mart and the reckless driving are a LOUSY excuse at best.
In the winter months there are NO lines at Wal-Mart and there are no "Hassidic" reckless drivers, yet the hatred that spills out of that rag sheet AKA The Times Herald is SCARY. (aka the winter residents of South Fallsburg and Kiameshe - never mind KJ...)
THe Wal-Mart lines and crazy driving is just a smokescreen.
They HATE us PERIOD.
They hate your "black hats"
They hate your "fuzzy peyos"
They hate your "million little kids"
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 31, 2006 11:32 AM
: July 31, 2006 11:32 AM
Yes there will always be those that hate us. But that doesn't give us the right to ignore our DUTY to be a light unto the nations.
It's not just a status symbol, it's a responsibility.
Fair or not, we are held to a higher standard. We said Na'aseh Venishmah, and it comes with the territory.
The undisputable fact is, many of us drive like absolute vildeh chayas upstate. And many others are discourteous to gentile and jew alike in the streets and in the stores.
Now by no means does everyone behave this way, but many do - and it reflects badly on the whole.
Isn't it logical that when a gentile sees a Yid with his payes, yarmulka and tzitzis cutting off drivers, and endangering people's lives - wouldn't it seem a tad hypocritical to him?
What's so difficult to take 2 minutes out of your day to strike up a friendly conversation with one of the residents? To walk to the back of a line, rather than pushing oneself to the front? To come to a complete stop at a stop-sign, and let the pedestrian cross, rather than almost run him down?
Cost benefit analysis: Couple minutes of my time for a tremendous Kiddush HaShem? Seems a good deal to me.
It's not just a status symbol, it's a responsibility.
Fair or not, we are held to a higher standard. We said Na'aseh Venishmah, and it comes with the territory.
The undisputable fact is, many of us drive like absolute vildeh chayas upstate. And many others are discourteous to gentile and jew alike in the streets and in the stores.
Now by no means does everyone behave this way, but many do - and it reflects badly on the whole.
Isn't it logical that when a gentile sees a Yid with his payes, yarmulka and tzitzis cutting off drivers, and endangering people's lives - wouldn't it seem a tad hypocritical to him?
What's so difficult to take 2 minutes out of your day to strike up a friendly conversation with one of the residents? To walk to the back of a line, rather than pushing oneself to the front? To come to a complete stop at a stop-sign, and let the pedestrian cross, rather than almost run him down?
Cost benefit analysis: Couple minutes of my time for a tremendous Kiddush HaShem? Seems a good deal to me.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 31, 2006 12:58 PM
: July 31, 2006 12:58 PM
You are right. We do stand out and should act more responsible. (Not that it will help much, but that’s not a reason to act like an animal).
However, this is how it is and it won't change. There will always be wild animal drivers and the cahsiddishe Jews will ALWAYS be hated by the locals. (not all, most)
What's even more shocking is that some of OUR OWN stoop so low and before they even hear the facts they blast and blame their fellow brothers.
Take the story in Williamsburg for example. Before they even knew who the driver was, you had some knuckleheads chiding the chassidim on how they drive.
This poor guy Mintz, not enough that he went through a trauma that he will live with the rest of his life. He now has his HEIMISHE brothers dismissing him for driving irresponsible, how do they know??? Do these self-hating Jews drive like pros? Are they the ones who give up a parking space at Wal-Mart for the goyim they so love?
I doubt it.
Now, that's SAD.
However, this is how it is and it won't change. There will always be wild animal drivers and the cahsiddishe Jews will ALWAYS be hated by the locals. (not all, most)
What's even more shocking is that some of OUR OWN stoop so low and before they even hear the facts they blast and blame their fellow brothers.
Take the story in Williamsburg for example. Before they even knew who the driver was, you had some knuckleheads chiding the chassidim on how they drive.
This poor guy Mintz, not enough that he went through a trauma that he will live with the rest of his life. He now has his HEIMISHE brothers dismissing him for driving irresponsible, how do they know??? Do these self-hating Jews drive like pros? Are they the ones who give up a parking space at Wal-Mart for the goyim they so love?
I doubt it.
Now, that's SAD.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : July 31, 2006 6:32 PM
: July 31, 2006 6:32 PM
What the Hassidic Jews be despised if they did not drive so crazy, act so rude and generally ignore the locals?
I am sure they would not be liked as the locals only like other locals.
But i do think you make it easier for non--hassidic/orthodox jews to think you are awful. Trying to get a bus seat on the Shortline made harder by stand ins sitting down until right before the bus leaves the station, not talking or basically ignoring non-hassidim in public. Just living in your own world all the time. Sheesh. Who want s to be nice to that person?
Yeah, people hate Jews. But nobody likes people who act like this.
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I am sure they would not be liked as the locals only like other locals.
But i do think you make it easier for non--hassidic/orthodox jews to think you are awful. Trying to get a bus seat on the Shortline made harder by stand ins sitting down until right before the bus leaves the station, not talking or basically ignoring non-hassidim in public. Just living in your own world all the time. Sheesh. Who want s to be nice to that person?
Yeah, people hate Jews. But nobody likes people who act like this.
Comment Credit ---This article posted by : September 08, 2006 10:44 PM
: September 08, 2006 10:44 PM
