Chaptzem Blog!      

may the shluchim of chabad lubavitch live on
and conquer the world with
yiddishkit

 

conquer the world? Is that their stated plan or unclassified plan?
Also is this the meshichists or anti's?

 

What do Lakewood, Chaim Berlin, Torah Temimah, Amshinov, Alecsander, Belzer, Bobover, Bostoner, Boyaner, Breslov, Ger, Stolin, Kloisenberg, Modzitzer, Muncatz, Pupa, Radziner, Rachmanstrivke, Satmar, Skverer, Slonimer, Tauscher, Vizhnitzer, etc., etc. have in common?

Answer: They've done absolutely nothing for Klal Yisroel.

Chabad* annoys me sometimes, but they got the right idea!

*My apologies to Chabad for even comparing....

 

Uh, if you mean kiruv, the bostoner rebbe certainly did some. He did more in boston then chabad was ever able to do.

 

I was referring to world Jewry but you're right, I realized that I should not have included Boston.

 

Hey Gross

Maybe you should remove Belz too! Belz has one of the biggest Tshuva movements in Israel with Uri Zohar being one of their first graduates as well as a huge Baal tshuvah yeshiva in Jerusalem. the annual chizuk mission to Dallas also comprises of mostly Belzer Chasidim as reported in Hamodia so maybe you should research before posting pure self hatred!

 

i guess all the yeshivas should send people all over the world at the age of 20 or 21 not knowing that much real torah and not having even a sembalence of daas torah. real meanigful kiruv and transmission of torah requires more than knowing sichos of the rebbe it requires knowing torah halacha and in genral having a solid foundation in torah and mussar. somthing which can not be aquired by the age of 20 or 21 especially when you spend many hours a day learning sichos from the rebbe as opposed to spending most of the time learning real torah and aquiring daas hashem and becoming bnei torah. sending people out without any backbone to resist the draws of todays society (i am refering to the things that rquire more subtle reasoning not straight up issur) is a terrible thing and the ends do not justify the means. on the other hand we should give the movment alot of credit for its vision and ability to send people all over the world far from home.

 

No pictures or videos of their fight?

 

What are you talking about? Chabad of Boston does waaaaaaaaay more kiruv than the Bostoner Rebbe!

 

Gross said...
What do Lakewood, Chaim Berlin, Torah Temimah, Amshinov, Alecsander, Belzer, Bobover, Bostoner, Boyaner, Breslov, Ger, Stolin, Kloisenberg, Modzitzer, Muncatz, Pupa, Radziner, Rachmanstrivke, Satmar, Skverer, Slonimer, Tauscher, Vizhnitzer, etc., etc. have in common?

They have educated countless erlicher Yidden to serve Hashem in the way proscriibed by the Torah.

Chabad is a failed and dying movement. Spreading Apikorsus is not exactly doing anything for world Jewry. Chabad has damaged the very essence of Klal Yisroel in a grave manner despite the fact that they might make you feel good.

 

Ohh, and by the way "Stolin" does a ton of kiruv here in NY, russia, isreal.

Stolin and chabad are both litvish chasidus.

 

The story that happened was as follows. The shluchim coming back from an inspirational kinnus (at approximately 12 in the morning), thought it to be appropriate to go to 770 and farbreng. At first the the tzfatim tried to stop the shluchim from pushing together the tables to farbreng. When that didnt work (the shluchim struggled with them, until they had the tables together), the tzfatim then took out the next weapon in their arsenal (their hands didn’t work this time against the high volume of shluchim). They brought out their fart spray and started spraying all the cans to make the shluchim leave. The bad odor did not intimidate or deter the shluchim and they actually just ignored it and farbrenged further. So they tried to sing yechi extremely loud but the shluchim just ignored them and farbenged further.
The shluchim sang “hiney ma tov uma noim sheves achim gam yachad” for about fifteen minutes in unity (there were shluchim of all stripes and opinions farbrenging together). It was unbelievable. The inspiration it brought was so thick and tangible. You couldn’t even hear the ten tzfatim which were screaming yechi. The Tzfatim gave up on their shouting yechi after about two hours of making themselves hoarse). The shluchim finally got to farbreng without menius veikuvim (hecklers). At approximately 3 AM rabbi Avremel Shemtov walked in. As soon as he walked in, the tzfatim brought back their arsenal of fart spray. It was ignored. The shluchim farbrenged further, beautifully, despite the unpleasant odors the tzfatim so graciously extended to the shluchim.
Twenty minutes later (after the tzfatim apparently informed their friends to immediately wake up, come to 770 and prepare for war against the shluchim) the tsfatim started whipping seforim into the direction of the farbrengen. The seforim instantly turned into live fire, which was literally dangerous. The shluchim and anash scattered for safety to be out of fire from the tzfatim’s seforim arsenal. Rabbi Avremel Shemtov was immediately ushered out by about ten shomrim to safety.
The tzfatim were unhinged (the police which had eventually arrived, were not equipped to confront these tzfatim, thought they successfully arrested several of them. It became increasingly dangerous to be within a mile from these tzfatim. It was ugly.
After the violence from the tzfatim was wrought upon the shluchim, the idea was proposed (in a shout out loud) to tear the yechi banner down in revenge.
Rabbi Moscowitz (head shliach to Illinois) walked out (in anger) bleeding from his face from an apparent tzfati gash in the face. Rabbi Yisroel shem tov was brought out onto a hatzala with a big gash by his eye. Rabbi Hartman (shliach to Vietnam) was brought by ambulance to the hospital after a bench which was thrown by the tzfatim crushed his leg. I didn’t notice any injuries amongst the tzfatim, though I can’t attest that there weren’t any.
The violence the Tzfatim brought onto the Rebbe’s Chassidim and shluchim, that sad and painful evening, was indescribable. At that point fearing for my personal safety I went home. I therefore cannot inform you on anything which occurred after the first half an hour of the initial (physical phase of the) tzfati attack.
Note: I copied and pasted this post and posted it on the tzfati – chabad.info web site. I have no faith that it will be posted by them for they carefully filter out posts which counter their agenda.
Please don’t copy and paste my post, on any non Chabad site, thereby bringing out our dirty laundry into the public eye.

 

I want to wish the chabad Rabbis hatzlacha rabbha and may hashem repay them for their mesirus nefesh with gezunt parnasah and chasidishe nachas from thir children and mekuravim!!!

i dont know what world Jewry would do with out you!!!!

 

My point , boston, was that overall the bostoner rebbe has done much more, as it is now, the rebbe is an older man who is hardly ever in boston cept on yuntufs. Chabad despite what you may think hasn't much of any influence over the years in Boston. I'm not saying that because of prejudice against lubavitch, its just the truth, ruth.

 

lets be honest.of course other yidden do kiruv but not close to the scale of chabad. whats the point everyone is appreciated for what they do

 

I became a ball teshuva because of Chabad.

 

Chabad rocks

 

I went on a business trip to China & while I was walking on the street I saw the Shlich there & he invited me in to his home, I davend mincha & mariv with a minyon.

Chabad is truly amazing.

 

"...They have educated countless erlicher Yidden to serve Hashem in the way proscriibed by the Torah."

"Gross; you have some nerve to post that these yeshivos are doing nothing for klal yisrael. Don't kid yourself."

I'll admit I have problems with Chabad, but the institutions I have mentioned are insular and exclusive, preaching intolerance and fundamentalism. They have helped create and sustain an enviroment that shelters thousands of men who are unemployed with absolutely zero ambition (other than marrying a checkbook.) My "nothing" comment was hyperbole. Obviously they have contributed somewhat. But Chabad sends out countless young men into the world (the real world, with no Eichler's, Emporio, Shomer Shabbos, Landaus, Moisha's, Glatt Mart, Kosher Delight, Central Ave, 13th Ave, etc.) to bring joy to so many otherwise unconnected Jews. They do this with a lot of acceptance and little agenda (well, relatively speaking at least.)

 

I would have to agree with Gross. While I do not totally agree with Chabad, they are the closest thing to giving a damn about another Jew. I have gone thru the stereotype system- typical litvish elementary education system, out of town yeshiva high school, and prestigious “yeshivas” in Israel. To some it all up “a bunch of self centered evil leaders”. They want money for themselves and their families and they want their constituents to be poor and reliant on the rebbe and the “tzoa” that comes out of the rebbe. They believe that numbers speak for themselves and would prefer to have as many ignoramus followers as possible. I must admit that I was totally turned off by these selfish evil geniuses. While I was in High school, one of my rabbeim told us “you are better off not davening than to daven with a chasidish minyan”. I wondered to myself “who is this Jew-hater?” It turns out that he was a Baal Tsuhva “noyef” In the course of my high school, I saw this so called “rabbi” send countless innocent children to the deepest depths that a Jewish soul can reach. Over a decade later these children have zero interest in Judaism. While all the organizations that “Gross” mentioned may have some good aspects about them, they don’t come close to Chabad. The entire Baal tshuva movement is riding on the back of Chabad. They are all copy cats and mimickers of the great Chabad movement. The definition of a Jewish leader was the great Lubavicher Rebbe ZT”L. Most of the other rebbe’s, especially the ones today are selfish self absorbed people. They worship the G-d of Mammon and if they were given the opportunity they would let out “gedolim” for “baal peor”


PS: I am totally not impressed by Uri Zohar. I prefer to see someone who was raised religious remain that way his entire life.

 

There is a Chabad house in every town, city and country- Their rates of Kiruv are in the Millions, I know because i am one of them and have succesfully helped over 102 families come closer to yiddishkiet, just in my city. Chabads original teachings are as good as gold. And Homophobic Bochur- Sorry to say but Uri Zohar is quite impressive. The Torah teaches that not even a tzaddik can stand in the place of a true baal Teshuva. Yes it is also impressive to stay in the fold but can you imagine all of the pleasures in life that Uri Zohar gave up? If you really knew him and let yourself be inspired, you would see a whole new world of good. Go Lubavitcher Rebbe! (not the fanatics)

 

I was there it was amazing.

 

I hope that everyone remembers a year in a half ago by the hurricanes & by the sinami, that chabad help everyone, gave them food, if they lost their house they gave them a place where to sleep.

The whole world benefits from Chabad.

 

Chabad help me so much times, I love you Chabad.

 

As a proud Lubavitcher Chossid I am outraged at the comments that none of the other Chassidisheh krizen does anything good for Klal Yisroel. This juvenile attitude hardly reflects that of our Rebbe who encouraged and admired other ADMURim and their Chassidim.

To the revered Chareidisheh oylom, please pay no heed to these stupid remarks. I and the majority of NORMAL Lubavitchers respect the good work that you do. Whether it’s with Bikkur Cholim, Torah programs, learning etc. This applies to the Chassidisheh and Litvisheh velt at large.

 

Just a Guy:

You exemplify the suberb public relations gift that Lubavitchers have. I gotta hand it to you.

 

The loobies send out their boys at an extremely young age to be rabbis. How much can these boys know if they barely spent any time learning Torah themselves? I happened to be in an out of town lubavitch community for shabbos a short while ago and the principal of the school was in his mid 20s. How can a 20 something year old have the daas torah and ability and life experience to run an institution? and the community rav was in his 40s and had been the rav for the past 20 years. Again, how can a 20 year old be enough of a talmid chacham for people to ask their shailos to? and Teaching Tanya to people is called being mikarev them? When theyre teenagers, instead of learning Halacha, hashkafa, mussar, etc., theyre standing in middle of the pritzus on kings highway, asking puerto ricans and mexicans if theyre jewish and if they want to put on tefilin, or frum women if they want to light shabbos candles. And before worrying about teaching tanya to the people out there, they should work on the tznius of their own women. Also, every sect of judaism has their chesed organizations, from russian kiruv to bikur cholim to hachnasas kallah to tomchei shabbos.... Chaim Berlin sent to Texas and Lakewood sent to Austrailia and Chofetz Chaim sends all over.....Everybody does for klal yisrael.

 

I fully agree with anon. 10:44pm as they say you can only give over ruchniyus if you become an overflowing cup. the lubiys are far from that in their approach. i have had the same experience as you in which these young guys are the rebbis of the schools and the shuls in these out of town lubavitch comunities and they have no da'as torah are not lamdanim or for that matter they do not know much halacha. they do not have the ability to make the fine distinctions required in many gray areas. one thing they are trained well in is how to be good poloticians and how to raise money from goyim. additionally what kind of shul only has siddrim chumashim and the rebbes seforim. if they were trully interested in making emesa ovday hashem they would not be so caught up in just teaching the rebbes seforim and showing videos of the rebbe and would teach them the basics of torah and gemorah but i guess since most of them were never taught how to learn they can not properly teach others. lubavitch could have been such a great force for klal yisroel but as the many gedolim of the previous generations saw, lubavitch is way off.

 

You should check out the Jewish Literacy courses that Chabad does, and all their adult education classes before you decide that all they teach is chassidus. And so long as you haven't tried to get another yid to do a mitzvah, don't knock anyone who did.

 

How old was the Stoliner Rebbe when he became Rebbe? and how old was he when he gave over Toirah to his Chassidim? did you ever see the Sefer, that just came out with the correspondences between the Lubavitcher Rebbe and the Ragechuver? did you ever watch a video of the Rebbe, to know what the rebbe tells/teaches his Chassidim? did you ever talk to a Lubavitcher bucher that goes on shlichus when he’s 20-21 to know if he might know halacha, or a little gemarah? where else do you find that there is a concept to learn chumesh/rashi of the week each day one aliya and learn either 1 or 3 perakim of rambam daily? does that give someone a little baisics in halacha and tell me learning minimum 3 hours a day chasiduss and minimum 6/7 hours a day learning gemarah and shilchun orech would that give someone the material to get off there tuchis and help others to appreciate that there’s an aibeshter that runs this world and to love him and to know that the whole purpose of this world was created to make a dierah (dwelling place) in this physical world through learning torah and doing mitzvos and not be a selfish person that the whole goal in life is to be a gadol and you have to do a mitzvah because otherwise your going to burn so yes learning a sicha and tanya might help a person realize his purpose in this world and there’s no halacha that says in order to teach someone something you have to be at a certain age or level in learning in fact it does say that if one person teaches someone even one thing he could be younger or dumber still you have to give him "koved harav" and for those who like to talk about the yeitzer horah it says that not necessarily does he come from or acts like a bad thing it can be a good thing like in the middle of shoneh esreh if a thought about doing a mitzva comes up that’s the yetzer horah trying to distract you from your kavonah so the same thing there can be good people oppsing what Chabad does. But chevrah ker a velt and don’t let the yeitzer horah get in the way and keep following the way rebbe is leading us in the ways of the torah and chassidus and then we will leave this bitter gulos with Moshiach tzidkaynu speedily in our days!!

 

no it does not say it anywhere. that is called daas torah and that is why you must follow the gedolim of tha past generations who have taught us for doros that you must first learn and then teach.

 

I would like to add a little information on what I know first hand about Lubavitch and theier Shelichim..
I am not a Lubavitcher Chasid, I am far from one and the Chasidis that I belong to does not and never did like Lubavitch too much because my Rebbe did ot believe in the way that the Lubavithers go out at a young age between Goyim in all parts of the world and become much worse off in Yiddishkeit then they were before they mingled with the secular world.But..there is a big But..what Lubavitch has done with putting up Chabad Houses and Shuls and Mikvas and Kosher food in the whole world nobody has done..I travel to many parts of the world for business purposes and wherever I go I know there will be a Minyan and kosher food and a Mikva ..thanks to Chabad..a few years ago I had to go to the Far East and I went to take a Bracha from my Rebbi, and he asked me if there is a Minyan or Yidden there and I told him that I do not know, so he told me to go call up Chabad and find out from them if they have a Chabad House there and if yes then you do not have to worry you will have everything that a Chasidisher Yid has to have when he is not at home..and this is from the.......Rebbi that wears a big flat Samet hat and is strongly opposed to any modern movements..It just come to show that everbody knows what Chabad does and everyone knows that sooner or later he will almost allways benifit from the good deeds of Chabad..

 

of course that is true e/o benefits from chabad. firstly does the ends justify the means. secondly is the gain of having chabad houses and the world justify having a generation of people deviod of emesa torah knowledge and ability to learn to paskin basic shailos.

 

B"H
Stam. If anyone is really interested about the true extent of Da'as Torah and knowlege Chabad has, why don't you just check up on their Jewish Learning Program (JLI), Adult education seminars and websites like Chabad.org and Askmoses.com

 

these are all window dressings. we are talking about knowing how to larn a sugyah in shas this is the basis of teaching others knowing yourself and not just knowing that there is a g-d who created torah but knowing his torah also.
btw i asked a delicate question to both askmoses and a non chabbad ask a rabbi kind of web site and the chabbad one did not give a straight answer just go ask your rabbi while the other did and i made it clear i was not going to be noheg just because they told me rahter i was trying to understand the concept in halacha

 

Regarding the young age of some shluchim.
It would be great if you could find a seasoned poisek who has been paskening for 40 years to go to every loch in the world but we all know that is impossible it wont happen.
So we are left with 2 options
1)Send noone.Let there be no one at all to answer any questions or learn with people.
2)Send the only people who have enough comitment to go. A young guy who can learn with the people there and answer basic questions and if there is something he dosnt know He sais " I dont know the answer to this shaale, I will ask a Rav and get back to you"
Keep in mind that most questions that Jewish people who have no Jewish background have in small towns are not complicated shailos that you need a big rov to answer. Most are very basic questions that any yeshivah bochur can answer.

Even if you think that each small town needs a telse rosh yeshivah ( I dont) still be realistic . Wake up IT AINT GONNA HAPPEN.

Regarding only learning and teaching Tanya. Its a lie. In EVERY Lubavich yeshiva in the world there is more time spent every day to nigle (Gemmoro, Shulchon oruch etc) than chassidus. There is seder chassidus in the morning and at night and the rest of the day is spent gemmoro iyun, Gemmoro girsa, halocho etc.

In every yeshivah there are bochurim who learn better and bochurim whose learning needs improving. Take a good bochur (there are many) from a lubavicher yeshivah who kept sedorim and learned. He can give a deep gemmoro or halochos shiur to rival a good bochur from any other yeshivah. Most shluchim wont need to as they are dealing with Jews who need a much easier leven of learning but if the need arises they can.

I think this all is pretty obviouse and anyone who is against shlichus because the shluchim are not gedoley hador is blinded by hatered.

 

1:13 Challenge any chabad bochur and you will be surprised by their wide and deep knowledge of gemara and shulchan aruch, You WILL be pleasantly surprised that they actually do know what their talking about on par with any other yeshiva bochur

 

everyone will do something here or there.

TRaditionally the lakewood kolel would only go to a place where chabad has been fro 15 years , creating awareness about yidishkiet, and only then once a mikva has been built, and the chabad sheliach has started a shul and a school, then vayovoi, the lakewood guys are here, and what is thier strategy, to go after the guys that chabad has been working on for years.

Also, i heard that aish, does not welcome older people, only young kids. You will find everyone who will find a way to say that theyare doing in kiruv. But trust me, if you are looking from a travleers perspective, you will only call chabad on the road. But if you look from a snag perspective, you will find every shmagegy doing kiruv.

Kiruv is fine. But you will have to be twisted like a tarnado to honestly say that anyone, or any group does 5% of what chabad does globaly.

PS, as for the few mishugoim who are mishichistim living in crown heights, most have never seen the rebbe, and themselvs baaly teshuva.

as for the hecklers, i think the right thing to do is encourage the shluchim, and support them, b/c they ARE the ones on the front lines. Living in boro park, and having access to 16 pizza shops, and 46 chulent resturants, with 6000 minyanim daily, is not mesirus nefesh. having to travel with your wife 225 miles to mikva is!

 

Have you all lost your mind? I'm reading these posts in disbelief...Do you think the Rebbe or any othe gadol would approve of talking like that of any other jew?! That's not how you'll speed the coming of moshiach, whoever that might be. People should concentrate on their own avodah and you should know that hashem does not expect the same avodah from every jew. Not everyone must go out to do kiruv, not everyone has the strength to sit and learn. Be proud of who you are but appreciate each other. Maybe someone should post the tefillah from the chofetz chaim that should be recited daily which includes "don't let me say lashon hara about a jew and even more so about a segment of the community". Shame on you people that insult the litvishe or the chabad world!!!

 

thank you rebbe for bringing me to torah.