Saturday, December 01, 2007

Matisyahu grows payes and becomes Karliner Chosid

It is only a few miles from Crown Heights to Greenpoint, Brooklyn, but in some respects, the asphalt avenues linking them bridge entirely disparate worlds.

Matisyahu Miller — known to his legions of fans by his first name, and to his friends simply as Matis — makes the trip almost daily. He bikes from the Crown Heights apartment he shares with his wife and two young sons to the loft space he’s just rented in the old industrial neighborhood, giving him a place to write and rehearse his next album.

"I might call it ‘Dream Awake,’" he says, as he cracks open a grimy window in the newly painted empty loft, sits down on the floor and lights a cigarette.
The title references the life he’s been leading the past several years as he moved from being a troubled suburban teenager into life as a frum Jew immersed at once in both the shtetl of his religious community and the world of reggae music.

Recent years have been "like a dream I had. All the pieces just came together, like a dream," he said.

But since making public that he is breaking off from Chabad-Lubavitch, the chasidic group to which he has been closely connected since before his 2004 debut album, there have been a few less-than-dreamy moments as well.

Now in a more religiously fluid place, "we’re just frum Jews," Matisyahu says of his family, in his first extensive interview since breaking off from Lubavitch. "I live in Crown Heights but I daven in Borough Park in Karlin" synagogues when he gets up early enough to reach it in time for morning minyan. "My wife loves the community; that’s why we’re still living in Crown Heights."

With his unruly beard, faded blue hoodie and little round glasses, Matisyahu, 28, fits easily into artsy, edgy Greenpoint, which is on the cusp of being colonized by yuppies but unlike neighboring Williamsburg isn’t yet populated by young parents pushing expensive strollers whose occupants wear tiny Ramones onesies.


Reading the whole article really gives meat to the many criticisms of Lubavitch.
Being that it appears to be a Lubavitcher web site, the writer is so obviously ignorant of some basic Jewish hashkofo that he doesn't realize the gravity of what he writes or he wouldn't have written it.


Good luck!!!
I can just see the next article entitled "Cutting off all ties with all of Judaism". Because “At first it was very exciting to me, but after learning it for hours a day for two years, the ideas weren’t fresh anymore.” So now he is trying Buddhism.


Its originally from The Jewish Week (reprinted on that Lubob website):



At least now when he does meshugane things, it won't be blamed on Chabad.


The link is to a chabad site, but the article comes from The Jewish Week, not chabad.


I like the way it's listed here,

« Please Say Tehillim for...
Matisyahu’s New Spiritual Groove


give him 4 more years and the same article will appear only it'll be matisyahu explaining why he's not religious anymore...


Used and abused
everyone knows that Mattis got his first debut from the Chabad Telethon, that's wbere his career really jumped. Maybe if he would've joined Aish he would've become more famous performing with a huge Artscroll rather than the hat and jacket. It's disgusting to see that such a "role-model" for today's youth acts in such a disrespectful and ungrateful way to the life and people that made him every inch of who he is. Mattew Miller was and would've been a nothing. Mattisyahu the Lubavitcher had it made. Now it's gone forever.


He's a lost soul. Freakin nut-job!!!

His music is woefull too. I'm glad he doesn't tie himself to Chabad anymore. WAKO!!!!!!


Y"all are not being fair to him. Just because he originally found Chabad and they were there to help in in his becoming religious, does not make it obligatory for him to stay Chabad.

It is NOT a "Hakoras Hatov" issue at all.

He may see some areas of Chabad that he is no longer comfortable with. He may wish to get more "Mainstream" in his Torah growth.

Chabad is pulling itself away from mainstream, and creating a "separatist" movement, separating itself from normal Chassidishe Judaism.

I have seen a few Lubavitchers who have close friends in other chassidishe groups, cringe embarrassingly when they hear their fellow Chabad people tell them that their non-Chabad friends are not "REAL CHASSIDIM" and that Chabad is the only "Real Chassidus" today.

I heard only last week a young Chabad man say to a Satmar Chossid, "The Satmar ROV was not a Rebbe, and not an ADMOR, and they are only a KeHilla and not a Chassidus."

A Chabad bochur in the same location, who is studying for smicha, was talking to a man from Lakewood, and he, the Chabad bochur, referred to their legendary and departed Rosh Yeshiva, HaRav Aron Kotler Z"L, as "Aron Kotler Yimach Shmo!!!"

To be honest, these two things themselves would make me run.

I myself, a "Non Chabad" but a "Real Chossid" live in an area which is slowly turning to become a "Yellow flagger" neighborhood.

I almost feel that I need to check out my window, then pick a time when all is "clear" to go out and get into my car to drive to shul.

This is just to avoid the annoyingly repetitive invites to their farbrengins and to their endless debates about their Rebbe being Moshiach.

Now, I DO have great respect for the Lubavitcher Rebbe Z"L, but I feel I should be able to not believe his is Moshiach without being badgered by continuous nagging by these Yellow Flagger Lubvitchers who will not take no for an answer.

They make me feel that in their eyes, I am a Loser because I have not accepted their Rebbe as "my personal moshiach" (grin)

Then they say he is the Nasee HaDor. and the Nasse of my dor.

When I tell them, very politely, "The Lubavitcher Rebbe ZT"L was a great man, but surely could not have been Nosee Hador to all, since so many Chareidei Yidden and Rabbonim objected to him. One can't appoint one's self nossee over the whole dor against their wishes." they get furious.

He may have been a great man, but he was a man.
He may have been a great man, but he was NOT my nosee.
He may have been a great man, but I have the right to doubt if he is moshiach.
He may have been a great man, the Chabad may be a good Chassidus, but all the other Chassidim are "Real Chassidim" also.

I was at a certain Chabad Shaliach's house for a Yom Tov meal a couple of years ago, (yes, he is a close friend of mine.) He made that comment to someone about Chabad being the only real Chassidus, and the only real Chassdim today.

His mother, who sat on the far side of the table replied clearly, "######, that is the stupidest thing you have said in your life. You should be ashamed of yourself to put other Chassidim down. Satmer, Sanz, Muncacz, and the rest are just as Chassidish as we are, and just because they do not learn the "stuff" that we call chassidus, does not make their chassdidus invalid.

Funny, it was only a short time ago, 2 years since that incident, when he lectured someone else who made that same remark, and told them that, "We here in Chabad tend to create our own definition of Chassidus, then use that definition to exclude other Chassidim. We are mistaken."

He went on to talk about a vacation he had among other chassidim, including many Satmar. He told how he was welcomed as one of them, with no one trying to "convert" him. Then he went on to say, "We at Chabad may have a great OUTREACH program, but no one can hold a candle to Satmar's INREACH program, helping those already frum with every form of help to live, from food on down."

Yes, you can see how this Chabad Shaliach, clearly an exception to the norm, can be my friend. But the majority make it hard for me.
I try, for I love every Yid, but when I hear Chabad putting other frum Jews down, I want to read them the riot act.

Can Matisyahu have some feelings like I have?


You can see from the article that he and his wife are already on different pages she wants to stay in CH he doesn't but he is doing it for her....Let see how long that will last and I hope his wife takes him to the cleaners when they split because as he said he always want to try new things why not try new woman as well.
Rumor has it that he was seen out with Rosie O'Donnell lets see who he will turn up with next time.


Now he is growing his payes....in a short while he will be cutting them off then his beard will go then he will grow long dreadlocks.
He isn't stable


sound like matis is getting the bill and hillary treatment. Vilification, scorn and abuse, to anyone who dares cross them.


Sadly to say, all it takes is to disagree with, oppose, or not think Chabad is wonderful, and their Rebbe is Moshiach, and you are in for a heck of a bad time.

Will we soon see Chabad lead "Inquisitions" ... where we are forced to accept their Rebbe as our personal savior or be tortured?

May not a chossid of one Rebbe leave and go to another one? It does happen in other places, with no recriminations. Why not Lubavitch?


What an ingrtae. He bites the hand that feeds him. Let klal yisroel say "Yechi Adoneinu Moreinu v' Rabeinu, Ha Rebbe Melech Moshiach, Le olom Voed" behaymru ve yomeinu. Chabad is not the only real chassidus per se. They are, however, the only ones nowadays who are close to the derech ha Besht. The Alter Rebbe was a talmid of the Maggid M' Mezritch, and while Rabbi Aharon M' Karlin was also one, Karlin-Stolin has not developed much chassidus and while Chabad produced the torah she bikasav of Chassidus, Karlin-Stolin has produced what? Beis Aharon? Chabad and Karliin-Stolin are the most authentic chassidic groups, but Chabad is far superior in its daas torah and in the quanitity and quality of torah it has produced and disseminated. They are the kup of Chassidus. Satmar may be the fists and anti-Israel kicking feet of chassidus (and theur first rebbe didn;t come unto the scene until R' Yom Tov's son Yoel came unto the scene in the late 1800's), Breslov is the heart of Chassidus (I think Breslov and Chabad are truly the closest to the derech ha Besht), Vizhnitz, Sanz-Klausenberg, nothing brilliant out of these dynasties. Face it, Chabad is authentic chassidus and is is the true Derech Ha besht, a derech which even the Satmar rov said was forgotten by practically all but Chabad. Remeber, he says that the Skverer, Vizhnitzer, Satmarer and Gerer all don't have the derech haBesht. Chabad and Breslov do. And, they don't refuse to learn English, live up to DINA DE MALCHUSA DINA, show gratitude to Israel, our holy nation, which is in our hands after 200 years of golus, get an education or hold a job/ parnassoh, and show appreciation for the nations they live in. That is why I am a Lubavitcher, why I chose the true Derech Ha Besht. Lubavitch is awesome. We have the daas chassidus, since our Alter Rebbe is the BAAL HA TANYA. Not the Sfas Emes, not the Divrei Yoel.


"but Chabad is far superior in its daas torah and in the quanitity and quality of torah it has produced and disseminated"




How come the rebbe is Moshiach and not the Besht?

Maybe it was because he learned gemora while Lubabs don't! So he was disqualified.
Maybe the Rebbe was just the greater of the two!


December 02, 2007 1:55 PM

It is crap like that stuff you write that shows that Chabad is certainly NOT EVEN REAL CHASSIDUS.

Chassidus is not learning Tanya. Guess what? Many non-Lubo Chassidim learn Tanya.

Chassidus is not excluding all others.

Chassidus is not putting all others down.

Chassidus is not talking trash about other Chassidim.

I have many Chabad friends whom I love, but to be honest, as a general rule, most of the non-Chabad Chassidim can learn MUCH better than the Chabad Chassidim.

I have a few Chabad Shaliach friends who are, unfortunately ahm haaratzhim! One who phones me all the time with shaylos. He knows that his "head shaliach" can learn even less than he can."

The entire tone of your blog was one of HATRED of those who are non-chabad. HOW CAN THAT BE CHASSIDUS.

Acceptance of Yidden is more important to Chassidus than is learning Sichos, Maamorim, and Tanya.

Only non-frum Yidden find acceptance in Chabad, as they are "customers" for the mivtzaim, and possible "Converts."

Already Frum people who reject Chabad are scorned by Chabad.

You have demonstrated exactly what the poster at 1:29 was talking about.

You just proved 1:29's point, and gave aidus to the accuracy of his words.



Your very words convict you. Your very words show that those you seem to hate are so right.

Stop turning that good man, your rebbe Z"L, into an avodah zara.

He was a good man.

He was a Jewish man.

You are using his name to form a new religion. You welcome new Converts by converting those who are not religious. And, just as those of that other breakaway religion, you do not ask them to follow the mitzvos. You only ask them to believe in your Rebbe as their Personal Rebbe.

You teach these new baalei tshuva Sichos of The Rebbe, while they do not yet know hilchos Shabbos! Some drive to your shuls on Shabbos and you sit and learn Sichos and Maamarim of your rebbe.

Do you not see something wrong with that? How about teaching the importance of Shabbos? FIRST?

You are using your Rebb's previous sayings as a form of New Torah. Your new deciples love it. It is not demanding on their actions. All they have to do is listen to those sichas which give them warm fuzzy feelings, and pseudo spiritual enlightenment.... with no legality, no laws that they MUST follow.

Don't you see that that is exactly what the others did 2,000 years ago. They created new writings, full of spirituality and did away with the laws.

They taught their New books and sort of left the old ones at the side. The old ones were hard to sell, as they mandated following a whole bunch of rules. The new ones only asked the converts to believe in their personal savior.

You are doing the same thing.
You are teaching only the Rebbe's sichas, and a tiny smattering of the holy Tanya, and not demanding that your new converts adhere to the rules and laws of the Torah.

Then, those of 2,000 years ago, did not want any who stayed with the old religion hanging around if they could not convert them.

You do the same. You push away any person who was frum from birth, or a baal teshuva who is already frum, if he or she will not accept your rebbe as their personal "Rebbe"

Your hatred to all other frum jews has pulled you away from Klall Yisroel.

Come back ... please .. before it is too late.

Do Y'all know that some professors of "Comparative Religions" have now identified Chabad as a "New Offshoot" from Judaism!!!!

One used this language: "Chabad is the first New Offshoot religion to brach away from Judaism in many hudreds of years. The last one was the failed Shabbatai Zvi... "

Yes, they are saying such horrible things of today's Lubavitch.

The goyim are recognizing Chabad as having left Yiddishkeit!

Please, out of repect for your Rebbe, come back.

Please, out of love for your Rebbe, come back.

Do Teshuva. Love every frum Yid as much as you love the non-frum Yid.

Stop trying to raise Chabad above all others by negating the greatness of other Rebbes.

Stop trying to raise Chabad above other Chassidus.

Can't you be happy loving your Rebbe as one among other great rebbe's of his dor?

Can't you be happy without trying to tell the world, that you rebbe was their Nossee? or the nosse hador?

It is this behavior of yours which pushes so many good, intelligent, loving REAL Chassidim away from you. Calling other great Yidden names like: Snag, and other bad names pushes the non-Chassidim away.


The Rebbe, MH"M, was the nosi ha dor. Let the misnagdim, such as Elazar Menachem Man Shach, say what they want about the Rebbe. Yeah, you say that acceptance of yidden is what cahssidus is about. What do the other chasidim do? Transgress the Torah by taking each other to court and suing each other for money? Sell diamonds and cameras at B&H and on 47 Street? Talk about how Moshe Rabbeinu was a Satmarer? I do have respect for other rebbes, including Nachman Mi Breslev (I find that derech to be an acceptable one), the Biala Rebbe, the Sfas Emes, Shmuel Mi Sochatchow, Kalonymus Kalman Shapira of Piasetzno, the Yismach Yisroel and others, but my point is that if you look at fact, Chabad is the most intellectual and authentic form of Chassidus that exists today, with Karlin Stolin on the same madrega perhaps, since their rebbe was also a talmid of the Maggid M' Mezritch. I have been ejected from the "mainstream frum" shuls of the Orthodox Union, Yeshiva velt and Young Israel since I spoke about the Rebbe in divrei torah and how he is the moshiach. I have even been ejected from yeshivishe mosdos, which shall go unnamed. Chabad is awesome and it is mamash the only hope for the future of Judaism in this world. Our numbers keep increasing and increasing, we are the largest Chassidish group by large, and we are paving the way for the Rebbe's return and for geulah sheleima. The misnagdim can say what they want, the satmarers can beat us and destroy our hadras ponim and crawl into a ghetto and read their chassidus, which is anti-semitic propaganda (blaming the Shoah on the Zionists, etc.)Just remember, Satmar kids BEGGED to learn Tanya from us. But, I will say, though, that the misnagdim are good for their hechsherim and their seforim. Shkoyach to them for that, and maybe also for the Gra's perushim.


Also, Chabad's goal is to disseminate torah observance and to spread the observance of mitzvos worldwide. And yes, we are machshiv torah and do learn Gemara, and some of us even learn the Daf Yomi. Even though we use the SHulchan Aruch HaRav for halacha le ma'aseh, I personally endeavor to learn as many peirushim as possible and I even learn Mishna Berurah. Yechi Adoneinu, Moreinu v' Rabbeinu, Ha Rebbe Melech Moshiach, le Olam Vaed!


who cares



I have seldom seen so much anger and hate. Pure Sinas Chinum.

You talk trash against Torah Giants, just because they represent alternate Chassidishe groups. For that alone you should be ashamed of yourself.

You then try to spread hatred of Jew against Jew, by trying to get the Zionists to hate the Satmar Chassidim. That is an act of rishus on your part. Pure Sinah and Rishus. No excuses, no other words for it.

You bring shame onto your rebbe. If he is half the tzadik you think he is, he is terribly ashamed of how you talk and behave.

You talk about in-fighting among other Chassidim, I understand Chabad has their own infighting. They tell me 770 has been "taken over" by the Yellow Flagger Yechi people, and the other Chabad people have to either make believe they are one of those, or are not made to feel welcome. I hear there are plenty of political fights in Chabad as well. Also, the Dinai Torah between Shluchim, and the system, and between Shluchim and their superiors, etc., are tying up batai dinim.

You talk trash about Satmar, for resisting your missionaries invading their kehillas and breaking up families! I applaud them. The person who you use as your symbol, because he suffered pulled beard in a fight... he knew that what he was doing was wrong. He knew he did not belong there.

Funny, any of you can go into Satmar to daven, and you are all welcome. Nobody will hassle you, and nobody will try to convert you. All they ask, is leave your agenda at the door, and do not do your proselytizing in their shuls. The have that right.

But, if a non-Chabad comes into a Chabad shul, he is often pulled aside and preached to.

"Believe in the Moshiach, The Lubavitcher Rebbe, and you shall be saved."

You do not leave others alone, when they come to daven in your shuls, and you do not leave others alone when you go to their shuls.

You make light of the Divrei Yoel, while other gedolim considered him a Giant in Torah and tzidkus.

You put down other Chassidish Rebbes wholesale.

You write: "What do the other chasidim do? Transgress the Torah by taking each other to court and suing each other for money? Sell diamonds and cameras at B&H and on 47 Street?"

The suing stuff, you are right, one point, but still loshon hora and rechilus.
Sell diamonds and cameras at B&H and on 47th st? What in the world is wrong with that?
They work for a living.

Actually, I am willing to bet a much higher percentage of those chassidim you trash are holding real jobs than Lubos. They sell and cut diamonds, yes, they also drive trucks, sell fish, sell electronics, are plumbers, electricians, and hard working people. They seen to earn enough money to build the words biggest and best moisdos of real tzdaka. Nobody... NOBODY gives more tzdaka than the people you are busy trashing.

You complain you are ejected from other shuls, and moisdois, but you admit you were preaching your Chabad Agenda. Showing no sensitivity to other Yidden, who have a right to keep their own beliefs just as you have your rights.

Some Yidden consider some of the Chabad ways ossur, apikorsus, meennus, or avak avodah zara. They have a right to those opinions, where you like it or not. I may not agree with them, but I agree they have a right to believe that. And if they believe that, they have a right to eject you when you are acting as a missionary as quickly as they would eject any other missionary.

You are your right to believe as you see fit, and SO DO THEY!

It is not wrong for them to say, "Keep your agendas out of our places!"

Any shul has a right to toss you out if you come in preaching the Lubavitcher Rebbe is Moshiach. That is their right.

If they came into your Chabad houses, or 770 and said Aron Kotler ZT"L was Moshiach, they may not come out alive! They may be beaten up, while the chabad people yell Yimach Shmo about their Rov!

They do not beat you up.
They do not yell Yimach Shmo about your Rebbe.
All they do is ask you to shut up or leave.

A person with normal Derech Eretz would either shut up of leave.

It is funny, you only listen to the particular words of your own Rebbe very selectively. Only the words you want to hear. If I remember right, the Lubavitcher Rebbe considered the Satmar Rebbe a Godol and Tzadik.

But you would trash one whom your own rebbe considered so highly.

Nobody from Satmar or anywhere else is beating you up or otherwise hurting you. You are making a big deal about something that happened years ago, and I believe it was his own fault.

So, all you are trying to do is spread hatred against your fellow Jew.
Is that Chassidus? NO WAY!
Is that Rishus? You Bet!

By the way, the Tanya is a sefer kodoish and revered by most every chossid. I have more than one copy in my home, and I do learn from it.

The Shulchan Aruch Harav has a prominent place in my seforim shrank, alongside the Tzemach Tzedek and others. And they too are consulted. Nobdy trashes those holy seforim, or their writers.

It would be nice if you had equal respect for the holy seforim from other Chassidim, instead of foolishly believing yours are the only seforim worthwhile.

All I am saying is quit trashing other Yidden just because they are chassidim of a different Rebbe.

When I was a buchor, if I went into any other shul, I would hear, "Vehmen's Chossid Bist Di?" Whose Chossid are you? It would never be said with anger, hate, or any negative feeling. We respected each other!

When there was a fahrbrenghen in CH, and some of us buchurim asked if we could go to listen to YOUR Rebbe, we were always told by our rebbes in yeshiva, "Sure, no problem." We would pack 15 buchurim in a station wagon and go from Willi to CH to listen to your Rebbe.

We would also go to listen to Satmar, Pupa, Minkacz, Stolin, etc. Not only that, but roshei yeshivos from many other yeshivos, even misnagdim were invited to give guest shiurim in our yeshivas.

That is the way Chassidim behave. Not trashing each other.

Stop trashing others, and stop trying to sell us on your rebbe's being Moshiach, and join with us in worshiping Hashem!

And Satmar kids did not need to BEG top learn Tanya from you. Many Satmar families have Tanyas in their home.

You claim to be the largest group!
Sure, if you count all those who are still driving to shul to attend your Chabad houses. But should they be counted as Chabad chassidim?

By last count, I was under the impression that those nice people in Willi, Satmar, were number one in true numbers, and Bobov #2.

I believe if you take all your real Lubavitcher chassidim, shluchim, their families, etc, they MAY come to #3 or #4

Claiming to be #1 is as silly as trying to get others to believe that YOUR Rebbe is Moshiach, or that YOUR Rebbe was the Nosee HaDor. Go ahead and think it, but stop trying to shove it down our throats.

I write this because I really admired and respected YOUR Rebbe, the Lubavitcher Rebbe Z"L, and I believe that your behavior is bringing shame on him and on his memory.

He did preach hatred, you do.


1:26 and 1:55 I don't remember hearing the "Tku B Shofar Gadol" nor did Eliyahu Hanavi come to my seder, nor do I remember seeing a line of white donkeys ( or limos or helicopters) lined up on Eastern Parkway recently. when I liook through the Kotel Cam I don't See a Bais haMikdash, Edom is still in power and yishmael is as strong as ever. So if your Rebbe is Moshicah, how come the Navuahs haven't been fulfilled? How can you say Yechi, when there is a shomer at the Rebbe z"l's grave waiting for the phone to ring? Will that be the second coming?

Let's see, both of you only speak about the Jewsih coming from Eastern Europe, as if they comprise all of Klal Yisroel. Would the Babi Sali consider a Lubavitcher Rebbe as the Nasee HaDor? How about Chacham Ovadia Yosef? Either way, if he was or wasn't He is dead and buried. And we know where there kever is, unlike that other guy from 2,000 years ago.

Like other chasidim, you gutys can only say great you are by putting down everyone else, especially those of us who hold strongly the halachos and Minhagim of Chazal. That you don't hold by The Shulchan Aruch, and hold by a reform version called the Shulchan Aruch HaRav, That you consider the Tanya the Torah, and anyone who doesn't learn from it a goy, kinda proves the point.

The Besht taught yidden deveikus without learning. The Besht was anti-Yeshiva. i guess by only klearning what your Rebbes have said, proves the point. Yes you may be the closest to the Besht's derech, but Ain Toarh Ain Kemach. Learning keeps frum Yidden Frum, not Sichas and mamorim


To all the busy people on this haylige website; why don't all of you get a life and quit arguing about one person that chabad was m'karuv, how about the thousands of other yoire shomayim charedish yidden chabad was m'karuv .I don't think any orthodox rabbi will tell you that this kind of loshon hora is going to hasten the moshiach regardless of who he is. if you want to know whether the lubavitcher rebbe is moshiach or not, if it helps your emunah as seeing him as moshiach then let him be if not, not.










except for lubos proclaiming that the rebbe is moshiach they have no intellect about anything else in the world that's why they suck.

you can spot a lubo miles away just by the way they dress- like a pure shloch- shirt sticking out of their pants, plain pants and white shirt on shabbos without jacket, they're all unkempt, the stink a mile away.



December 03, 2007 7:21 PM

you've written one of the very best comments. yashar koach!


can someone give a lesson for lubo men on how to dress when they walk out in the streets? also to advise them that it's not a sin if they don't drink excessively.


lubos must be dressed like a mensch and not like a behaimah like they all do. it's not a wonder why people are turned off by them. they scare people by the way their dress- no not by the fact that they stop people and ask if you're jewish and if not they try to get you to put on tefillin, the way they dress is disgusting- shirts tucked out of their pants, shirts/ties all stained, totally unkempt.


did anyone hear of praying to a dead person thinking they're our savior, the moshiach?

How ridiculous/crazy for lubo to think that the rebbe is moshiach.

they wear yarmulkas saying yechi on them. unfortunately when they'll have children they'll instill in the children's minds that the rebbe is moshiach. what a sickness.


December 03, 2007 7:21 PM

words well written

yasher koach


does the rebbe also say taht lubos can only eat rubashkin or shor habor shechita and other shechitas like meal mart, empire, galil are not kosher?

What about dairy products? Are only morning select, Tevye the only koshe brands that lubos can use and every other brand is treif?

get a life all of you Lubos.

You all make me sick. Move to Queens where the rebbes Matzeivah is.



Last line was meant to say:
"He didn't preach hatred, you do."


Halachic RulingIn his public address of Shabbat Parshas Shoftim, 5751, the Lubavitcher Rebbe asserts that according to Torah law (Maimonides, Yesodei HaTorah, chapter 7), there is a prophet in our generation, and we are required to heed his directives. The Rebbe said:

"It must be publicized to all members of the generation that we have merited that G-d has chosen a person endowed with free choice, who is incomparably higher than the members of this generation, as the judge, counselor and prophet of the generation, to provide instruction and advice pertaining to the service of all Jews.... [His council extends] to the most fundamental prophecy - "Redemption is imminent" and immediately, literally, 'Behold he (Moshiach) comes."'

In light of Maimonides statement in Hilchos Yesodei HaTorah, 7:1, 9:2, 10:1, we the undersigned consider thet according to Torah law the Rebbe King Moshiach is a prophet. Moreover, in his public addresses the Rebbe clearly alludes to the fact that he is a prophet. Indeed, time and again, before the eyes of the Jewish people and the rest of the world, the Rebbe has accurately predicted the future. The Rebbe foresaw with incredible precision the unfolding and outcome of such events as the Six Day War,the Gulf War, and numerous other events. As such, there is an obligation to heed the Rebbe's every instruction, and to believe his every word.

On Shabbat Parsha Vayeira, 5752, the Rebbe said: "At the present time, all obstacles and hindrances have been nullified. As such, Moshiach (not only exists, but in fact), is also already revealed. All we have to do now is welcome Moshiach Tzidkeinu in actual reality."

On Shabbat Parshas Mishpatim, 5752; the Rebbe said the following: "...The ruling of the rabbanim and halachic authorities that the time of the Redemption has arrived - i.e. "A king will arise from the House of David... it is presumed that he is Moshiach," [- the Rebbe added to the halachic ruling :-] "until the state of "definitely Moshiach." In this public address, as well as numerous others, the Rebbe clearly hints at the fact that he is King Moshiach.

In light of these statements, and in light of the Rebbe's encouragement of the proclamation "Yechi Adoneinu", it is incumbent on every single Jew to heed the Rebbe's words and believe that he is indeed King Moshiach, who will be revealed imminently.

Long live our Master, our Teacher & Rebbe King Moshiach for ever & ever



I really hope you ARE misquoting your Rebbe, for those remarks are very close to crossing the line. I will not say what line, you all know.

Maybe that is why some will not eat Lubavitch shecita, as there is a some who are very close to, or already over the line into kefira.

There is NO WAY your Rebbe is Moshiach. PERIOD

There is NO WAY your Rebbe is a Nahvi or "Prophet". PERIOD

I hope you are really misquoting him. For you are making it sound like he was proclaiming himself as a Nahvi ... which would put him WAY over the line...
and proclaiming himself as Moshiach which only makes him insane.

You know, when I heard other rabbonim say there is too much kefira in Lubavitch, and they have stepped way over the line, I made light of that, and thought they were over-reacting.

I always protected Lubavitch.

However, if what you write is accurate, they they are correct!
(and I can no longer protect Lubavitch)

Someone out there, tell me this man, 10:38 is totally misquoting. Please tell me those things were not said by this person who I thought was a Tzadik.... or at least a sane, good person.

For if he did say those things, I no longer have any respect for him at all! ... and will now believe that one truly may not eat Lubavitch shechita. And... maybe there is a problem counting those of you who believe this stuff in a minyan!



with all that's going on with rubashkin, why do people still eat rubashkin? rubashkins meat are contaminated. better be a vegetarian than eat rubashkin. that's exactly what i do. i don't eat meat, chicken because i can't find a shechita in the stores other than rubashkin.


This is a Psak Din signed by 1000 Rabbonim affirming the Rebbe's Messiahship and Kingship.


The rabbonim are listred here: http://www.ksol.org/image.asp?f=psak_large.pdf&d=11


I always sided with Lubavitch, but I hate to say it ... I just read that "Psak" and the list of "rabbonim" signnatories.

It is now clear to me that those opposed to Lubavitch were and are halachakly correct. Lubavitch, is proclaiming their deceased Rebbe as a Prophet and Messiah.

You guys have certainly crossed the line.

I will no longer count one of you in a minyan.

I will no longer answer Amain to one of your brochos.

I will no longer daven in a minyan if one of you is baal tefilah.

I will no longer make kiddush with you in the same room.

I will no longer allow any Shor Habor, or Rubashkin in my home, and will kasher all keilim that can be kashered, and dispose of the rest.

I will, from now on, treat you Lubavitchers as people of Jewish origin who have converted to another faith.

May Hashem have rachmonus on you all, and help point the way for you to return to Judaism.


Mattisyahu, you are right. Be rid of these nuts.


thank you matisyahu for no longer being a lubavitcher. you're doing the right thing.


December 05, 2007 12:05 AM

All your points are valid.


just because you live in CH does not mean you have to be a lubov.

Don't let the lubov crowd brainwash you to return in being a lubov again


Chabad Lubavitch is changing the world one perosn at a time by spreading Ohr Chassidus and Ohr Torah among Am Yisroel. We are bringing countless m'karev one at a time, and we are also spreading the Sheva Mitzvos amongst goyim, reaching everyone on every madrega. We were the first involved in any work like this, before Aish ha Torah and Or Somayach, Oorah, and the Novominkser Rabbi Perlow "chapted" the notion of outreach. We are paving the way for Moshiach's revelation and are over 150,000 strong and growing every minute, bli ayin hara. Matisyahu used us to rise to prominence, and he used the black hat and kapota as a gimmick for making kesef. We are the real Chasidim and are on fire for HaShem and His Moshiach, the Rebbe, MH"M, Le olom voed.


what's more important than "Outreach" is "INreach" where you have different mosads in helping out fellow jewish people. This would mean somehing like having funds for Hachnosas Kallah, visiting people in hospitals, having money to feed poor families especially by yomim tovim especially Pesach to but the very basic wine, matzos, having transportation provided for those that don't have their own to get to their doctors appointments, visiting the sick at home and in hospitals, and the like.

When you do these Mitzvos that's when you can say that you helped people.

People get annoyed when you ask them if they're Jewish and if they say no you say come here let me put you on some tefillin. There are many people that will immediately run away from you.


We do that too. Did you ever hear of Colel Chabad, the oldest R' Meir Baal Hanes charity in Eretz Yisroel?


There are plenty of Chassidishe organizations that do Inreach programs that are NOT lubavitch. Lubavitch is NOT all that!


I live in Brooklyn and when I ask people if they know about the Lubavitcher organiztion Colel Chabad, the oldest R' Meir Baal Hanes charity in Eretz Yisroel which they do inreach programs they all say NO.

I have NEVER experienced a Lubavitcher Mosad take me to hospitals or doctor appointments where I HAVE EXPERIENCED other Chassidishe sects taking me to doctors, arranging a place for me to sleep if I'm not allowed to sleep in the hospital next to my relative.


The Rebbe MH"M's mission was to all people- any Yid is welcome at our sederim, shabbos dinners, holiday events and other programs. I would think that for a frum family, attending these events would save them money, thus qualifying it as inreach.


December 09, 2007 9:56 AM

In the Hagadah it says Kol DICFIN Yaisay Veyachol
which means whoever is hungry should come in to our house.

This DOES NOT MEAN that ONLY LUBAVITCH fulfills this Mitzvah.
People on a whole should do this Mitzvah as well as having orchim for shabbos for the lest fortunate people that don't have money to buy shabbos foods.

There are Chassidishe sects (especially Satmar)that do far and beyond of fulfilling the mitzvah of having guests for Pesach and other Yomim Tovim and Shabbos.


It is DEAD WRONG for Lubavitch to "CONVERT" any person to their sect, following the ways Lubavitch doing things because this was what the Rebbe asked his Chasidim to do.

NOONE should approach a goy and ask if they're Jewish or not, and if not they'll put Tefillin on you. A person has a right to be Jewish or not. Lubavitch should NOT pressure people to out Tefillin on, light candles, etc.

Let people live their own lifestyle.


December 09, 2007 9:56 AM

Satmar has constant volunteers visiting people in hospitals, provide transportation for those in need of going to a doctor or hospital, etc. They even arrange that kosher food is provided to the patient at all times.

Why doesn't Lubavitch have Bikur Cholim buses? Why doesn't Lubavitch do the inreach (visiting the sick, providing transportation, etc) like Satmar?


Today, lubavitch is 2 main avenues.

1) to grow the global chabad house, shluchim effort, which today has a presence in every major city in the world where jews can be found - this yields the baal teshuvas in number more then any other jewish outreach organization in the world, where no one can hold a candle near this awsomeness, this true fact cannot even be debated.

2) the chabad chasidus, which chabad by definition - is chachma bina and daat - this is an intelectual approach of understanding and loving hashem to serve him better with joy, and simcha.

now. as far as some other problems that go on, i.e. tzenius, kids falling off the derech, crazy mishechisten, please understand that there is no quality control, there is no possible way for anyone to create a chabad potrol, of who says what, and who cna and cannot represent the rebbe.

further understand that so many were, and are atracted to the rebbe, and want ot be connected with the rebbe, and simply dont know better.

yet the fact still remains, every non-lubab travling someone and gets stuck for shabbos, will always check chabad.org to see if they can find a chabad sheliach to mootch off a meal, or a place to stay. and then all of a sudden says, oh, i love chabad.

Listen, if you are sincere, and you are a jew who looks for ahavas yisroel, and not chas v'sholom the opposite, then do the following,
a) see what the rebbe himself wrote, and contributed to torah, and b) talk to hte rebbe's people who he put in charge.

Rabbi Krinsky, Rabbi Groner, Rabbi Shem tov.

they too are struggeling with the growth of how big chabad became, and as a result misugoyim came too. in many cases they came from other communities.

as for me, my father was a chosid, but not chabad, he learned the rebbes chasidus, and chabad chasidus, and procliamed that where is and the chasidus he was learning was nothing compatred to chabad. does it make chabad any bettter then th rest, no!, but the fact still remains, that many more are being atracted to chabad, then a few snags in boro park spewing thier hate.

oh, well, for the sake of klal yisroel, please don't judge "chabad" again, if you are truly seeking ahaval yisroel, see wha the rebbe himself wrote, and said, and if you have any questions feel free to reach out to rabbi krinsky.


December 16, 2007 10:58 AM

"that many more are being atracted to chabad"



if he wants to cut ties with lubabitch kol hakovod he finnaly relised what bs lubabbitch is it dosent dosent mean hes becomeing a buddist or hes growing dredlocks,oh and the only reason lubabitch makes bal teshuvos is because they want to make these naive pepole looking for light in there lives become part of there cult


Thanks to the poster who referenced the pdf with those who signed about the Lubavitcher Rebbe being Moshiach. Is there any alphabetical listing in English that would be easier to reference?


Granted this is a bit late but I wanted to throw in my two cents. I consider myself to be a Lubavitcher Chossid.

In my humble opinion (and that of most Lubavitchers worldwide), the people that wrote that psak din, the lunatics that have taken over 770, and mishigoyim like the earlier commentator are not only clearly violating the Rebbe's exlicit instructions but are completely misrepresenting everything Lubavitch and the Rebbe are about.

Yes, there is more than one legitimate derech.

Yes, every Yid can (within the bounds of halacha) believe in whichever Rebbe's words he wants.

Yes, it's 100% wrong for people to enter other shuls and shove what they think is Chassidus down their throats.

and finally..

The Rebbe never said he was Moshiach. Neither spoken nor written, you will not find it anywhere.


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